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palmate or smooth? |
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Sharpbill
Member Joined: 14 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Posted: 14 Jun 2013 at 11:00pm |
Hi All,
I'm looking for some ID help. I know there are difficulties in separating female palmate from smooth newts and I confess I have never knowingly seen a palmate. What do you think of this individual I photographed in the south Manchester area on 13th June - could it be my first palmate? It certainly has an unspotted throat with dull pinkish shades, but I don't know the extent of variation in smooth newt females. There were also male smooth newts in the same pond. |
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liamrussell
Senior Member Joined: 13 Jan 2005 Status: Offline Points: 100 |
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I would say this is a smooth newt as the throat is more beige than pinkish. Would you be able to upload the photo at a higher resolution, or a higher-res crop of the hind feet?
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will
Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1830 |
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I'd agree, for the reasons given, plus perhaps some speckling on the throat as well.
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GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
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Smooth, agree with above the speckled throat and boldness of the belly spots instantly says smooth to me. There are individual smooth newts with just a few throat speckles and less defined belly spots too.
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Sharpbill
Member Joined: 14 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Thanks to all respondents,
My hopes are diminishing but in answer to Liam's request here are some close ups plus a second image of this individual (where the throat looks perhaps a little pinker?). Unfortunately they were all taken on a mobile phone so are poor quality. Regards John |
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Sharpbill
Member Joined: 14 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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To further my case could you get tubercles like this on a Smooth Newt?
Regards, John
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Matt Harris
Senior Member Joined: 03 Jun 2003 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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I think what you point to is just the normal texture of the foot you get in all species, as opposed to the two prominent white bumps you can get in palmates.
My initial reaction is that this is a smooth newt :) |
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Local Authority Ecologist
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Sharpbill
Member Joined: 14 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Many thanks for all the input on this ID. I've learned quite a lot and will continue my Palmate search
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Sharpbill
Member Joined: 14 Jun 2013 Status: Offline Points: 14 |
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Continuing my search for my first palmate I think I cracked it this evening. I visited an upland pond where I have observed newts in the past and netted this individual. Looks good to me
BTW Any idea what the eggs are - from same pond and approx. 5cm x 3cm. Some snail sp. perhaps. Cheers, John |
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liamrussell
Senior Member Joined: 13 Jan 2005 Status: Offline Points: 100 |
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Yes that one is definitely a palmate. The throat is the right colour and you can see the two white tubercles on the hind feet. On the the smooth newt they are brown (both species have them, it is the colour that is important).
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