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Frogs spawn |
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Liz Heard
Senior Member Joined: 27 Apr 2010 Location: South West Status: Offline Points: 1429 |
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You're right of course Suzi, but in a way we've intervened from the off by digging our ponds, excluding fish and generally encouraging - effectively farming - frogs in the first place.
It's still a long way from manipulating weather, IVF, GM crops, Gene Editing and attempting to reanimate dead pig's brains though eh? I've seen newts voraciously chase and devour young frog tadpoles, and they will also gladly eat the egg 'dots' (but not the jelly) in the centre of freshly-laid frogs spawn. As the tadpoles grow though, they become a bit unwieldy. In a fabulously busy and perfectly clear (yesss!!) amphibian pond (common frog, common toad, smooth newt and palmate newt easily observed) on a local nature reserve last week, i watched a male smooth newt chase, gobble - and swallow - a toad tadpole too. That was something i hadn't expected since a lot of predators leave those alone, finding them distasteful. Have seen fish for example, snap them up but within seconds they spit them back out again. I remember reading once that some grass snakes will eat toads. Does Will, Gemma, Caleb or anyone know if there's a similar story of limited newt predation of toad tadpoles then, or do they all happily consume them (and i just haven't seen it happen before)? Proudly presenting my first 'hand-reared' 2019 froglet! |
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Suzy
Senior Member Joined: 06 Apr 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1447 |
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The spawn that I moved into my new small pond (one clump) as mentioned previously is doing well. In fact I can't believe how fast the taddies are growing. Certainly growing more quickly than ones in containers I've reared. They are not so crowded (even though I tried to spread captive taddies over many containers) and no problems with water overheating, which I had with containers if they got more than a few hours sun. In fact they are loving all the sunlight (when we have any) and the natural food in the pond must agree too. I specifically got this small pond hoping it would be good for frog spawn rearing, and so far it is.
I think we all do hand rearing to give species the best chances, when perhaps on their own the conditions might not be so good. However for whatever we're rearing it takes a level of commitment and understanding and still things can go wrong. Nature allows for high mortality, but it is hard sometimes to step back and let nature take its course.
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Suz
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chubsta
Senior Member Joined: 26 Apr 2013 Location: Folkestone,Kent Status: Offline Points: 430 |
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Suzy - I feel the same about hedgehogs - the main 'carer' for the rescue wants to get every hog in that anyone sees, if only to give a it a once over and check for lungworm etc, whereas I am very much of the opinion we should let them live their lives naturally and only intervene if we identify there is a problem, of course by then it may be too late. There are positive and negatives to both options.
'Interfering in nature' by helping animals long, such as the tadpoles, puts them at other risks but as ben has said, we have already had a negative impact on them as humans anyway so perhaps we have a responsibility to help them if we can. As we put a pond in at our other house I felt duty bound to put some spawn in and now have a healthy crop of tadpoles so I guess that is spreading the risk and any poisonings or overflows that affect my original population at least won't be felt by the new ones
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Suzy
Senior Member Joined: 06 Apr 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1447 |
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Ben, aren't there restaurants where you can look in the tank and choose which fish/lobster you want to be cooked for you to eat? Maybe your newts are doing the same but getting in the tank to choose! That is if they eat tadpoles.
I just felt that it was such a lot of work tadpole rearing when things could go wrong and maybe they'd have fared better on their own. Some years I had brilliant success, others not so.
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Suz
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Liz Heard
Senior Member Joined: 27 Apr 2010 Location: South West Status: Offline Points: 1429 |
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If the water isn't clear enough to tell, i wouldn't give up hope yet Gemma.
A few years ago all the spawn in one of my ponds disappeared shortly before i went away for 3 weeks. When i returned - to my delight - it was teeming with tadpoles. Personally, i would have 'farmed' some spawn as insurance though. I completely understand why you and Suzy would adopt let-nature-take-it's-course, non-intervention stance, but humans have made these such difficult times for our herps that i don't see any harm in giving them a little 'leg up' here and there. In addition to the 15 tadpoles (which now have hind legs) on my kitchen windowsill, i put some spawn (now small but free-swimming tads) in a huge aquarium that's standing near the pond in the garden. During the past week, 8 newts (all males) have scaled the 45 cm glass, negotiated the large, overhanging 'lip' at the apex, and dropped inside. Edited by Liz Heard - 06 Apr 2019 at 11:33am |
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Suzy
Senior Member Joined: 06 Apr 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1447 |
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Yes I thought it was you Chubsta, but lazily didn't look back before typing.
Newts do eat taddies I believe, but I've not seen this myself. I have spent many an hour watching taddies swimming about and newts ignoring them. That's not to say they won't eat them though! I did once find a palmate in the centre of a clump of spawn when I netted it out of the pond to hatch elsewhere. Maybe my palmates are a smallish newt to tackle the taddies once they put some weight on.
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Suz
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chubsta
Senior Member Joined: 26 Apr 2013 Location: Folkestone,Kent Status: Offline Points: 430 |
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Suzy, I think it was me who sadly had thousands go over during a rainstorm a couple of years back - my solution to this problem is that the 'waterfall' only occurs in one small area so I have put in loads of thick plants which will hopefully act as a form of sieve and allow water through but stop the majority of tadpoles. We also had a lot of hail and rain last night and the pond did overflow as expected but no sign of any tadpoles going out, although I guess they are still too small to be at risk as they tending to stay at the other end of the pond to finish eating the jelly and some dead spawn.
Quick question - are newts a big predator of tadpoles? At our other house we put a small pond in last year into which I put a couple of clumps of my spawn (I know you aren't suppose to do such things but we have never seen any frogs in the garden and wanted to help start a population). The tadpoles have hatched but we have at least a couple of newts in the pond and my other half thinks the numbers of tadpoles are going down and is blaming the newts!
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Suzy
Senior Member Joined: 06 Apr 2005 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1447 |
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Let's hope Gemma that they are thriving unseen...
After being mostly dry for weeks we are getting some rain here - and hail and sleet. Last night it was forecast to do quite a bit of heavy rain, so I felt I had to bail out the new small pond in case rain caused it to overflow and the taddies went over the edge in a deluge. This is one thing with rigid preforms - they do have a hard edge that can lead to overflowing. Someone on here had his taddies all go over the top the other year I recall. Unfortunately I only remembered this potential rescue mission as the light was fading, so I had to shoot out and get my white washing up bowl and a scooping container and start operations. I put my head torch on too in case light failed. As it is only a small pond I only needed to scoop out a small amount of water to lower the level to a hopefully safe level. The white bowl meant I could see if I'd scooped up any wildlife, which I would then have returned. In the event it hardly rained! The taddies are doing very well and it is lovely to see them, which I can't in the duckweed pond, but trust they are still there.
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Suz
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GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
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Little concerned here as though we saw the spawn hatch, no signs yet of any free swimming taddies. Hope I don't live to regret not giving them a helping hand this year. Does very little to reassure me that the environment these days in rural East Anglia is a good place for common frogs.
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Liz Heard
Senior Member Joined: 27 Apr 2010 Location: South West Status: Offline Points: 1429 |
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Yes, hope you're back tadpole watching soon Chubsta.
Glad to hear you both have taddies doing well. Still hearing a few male frogs calling from the pond, long after the last traces of spawn have disappeared. Hard to say how it fared as the pond is well vegetated and any attempt to part the vegetation stirs up clouds of sediment. |
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