the online meeting place for all who love our amphibians and reptiles |
|
Slowworm pits? |
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Author | |
will
Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1830 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
Posted: 19 Apr 2017 at 2:58pm |
Thanks Gemma, that's very helpful - I wonder if they linked the ability to use pheromones with these pits? - as you say, I'll have to get to the bottom of it or I won't be able to sleep at night!
|
|
GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
There seems to have been study regarding pheromones in Anguis fragilis, for example:
Reading this research or referenced articles might help Will, as at some point someone may have defined or at least speculated on how the scents are deposited.
|
|
GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I've read the results of experiments using Vaseline Will, though usually to be fair it is used to cover up much large 'pits' or the nostrils. I do not think they need mini blindfolds lol.
I like Caleb's suggestion, the small size does seem to suggest secretion rather than detection. General males only have femoral pores, in some species of reptiles both species have them present but they are generally larger in the males. I would suggest checking images of males and females is the next logical step in the investigation. You are just going to have to get to the bottom of it Will!
Edited by GemmaJF - 19 Apr 2017 at 1:28pm |
|
will
Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1830 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
@Gemma - thanks for the suggestion. Playing devil's advocate I can see people asking how we know the vaseline didn't get wiped off/interfere with their nostrils/do we need them to wear tiny blindfolds to make it a properly controlled experiment etc etc and then you have the problem of getting the little darlings to feed in an observable setting like a small vivarium and also the question of controlling for size, appetite etc.
I think a good quality scanning electron micrograph would be a start, but you'd need a dead animal for that - oh, and a good quality SEM as well @Caleb - interesting, I hadn't considered that possibility - if analagous to femoral pores then only males should have them - ought to be easy enough to photograph females to see if this is the case. If so, how would they be used in the secretive world of the slowworm, I wonder? |
|
Caleb
Senior Member Joined: 11 Apr 2011 Status: Offline Points: 660 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
My wild guess is that they're pheromone-secreting pores. They haven't got anywhere to put femoral pores...
|
|
GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
If there is nothing in the literature and I cannot find anything, what about a 'prey targeting' experiment? Cover the pits with Vaseline and see if it reduces a slow worms ability to detect and target prey?
It is a simple non-invasive and non-harmful experiment that 'might' reveal the pits actually have a function?
|
|
GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
I thought they seemed reasonably uniform on the images I looked at. But there were some images where I could not make them out at all, but then that could be colour variation of individuals making them hard to spot in some images.
|
|
will
Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1830 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Hi Gemma
I definitely don't think they're anomalies or mites as they are distributed so regularly along the trailing edges of the scales - like rivets, almost. But as to what they are, or how I could prove my hunch I have no idea - I guess I need to find out who is a world expert on Anguid lizards. |
|
GemmaJF
Admin Group Joined: 25 Jan 2003 Location: Essex Status: Offline Points: 4359 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
It is interesting, my gut feeling is they are just a little anomaly in the scales or the work of mites or something lol. But it might be worth looking at the heat sensitive structures of the pit vipers and particularly the labial pits found in the boas and pythons. We know other reptile species have developed specialist sense organs in this area so it could be worth investigating it further. Edited by GemmaJF - 18 Apr 2017 at 5:16pm |
|
will
Senior Member Joined: 27 Feb 2007 Location: United Kingdom Status: Offline Points: 1830 |
Post Options
Thanks(0)
|
Interesting Gemma - perhaps routes for nerves going from the 'pits' to the cranium... or maybe I'm reading too much into this, but I'd love there to be something to it!
|
|
Post Reply | Page 12> |
Tweet
|
Forum Jump | Forum Permissions You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot create polls in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum |