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Surrey Smooth snakes

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j gaughan View Drop Down
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    Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 11:58pm
12.55hr a large heavily gravid ad under tin on a mid-county ARC managed site on a private estate;
interestingly with missing tail-tip, but not to extent on the animal in Vicars opening post

full sun, hot day with light wind, young birch being removed with only few incidential sightings _
VB sub-ad male out
AF sub-ad female under tin
ZV 3 juvs on oak log, one still out at 17.00hr

john
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AGILIS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2010 at 6:16am
hi Steve not that easy but the denim jean material seems to almost match except the pink one
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Vicar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vicar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Aug 2010 at 1:03am
If anybody wants to try their hand at matching snakes.....
Fill your boots: http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/OohVicar/CaID#


First snakes giving birth this weekend, although the odd juvenile the week before. Most animals are still gravid.

One from Saturday, basking on a bank.




Steve Langham - Chairman    
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Vicar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vicar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2009 at 9:17pm
I think you're right Robert.

When I was less knackered, I checked the scalation as well as the markings.

For the first pair, look at the last light-coloured scale in the middle of the dorsum, right up against the dark 'butterfly' head marking. Count the dorsal scales between this light scale and the dark Parietal scales. A different count between the two animals. Probably closely related animals though.

In the second pair, the markings are less closely matched, and again look at the foremost dorsal scale. Set centrally across the join between the Parietals (right), but offset on the left pic. Again a subtly different scale count too.

It's normally much easier to tell two animals apart. Only rarely do you get such close matches. See below for more 'normal' pairings.





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Robert V View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Robert V Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Dec 2009 at 7:14pm

Steve,

I'd say different animal.

Look at the flanks, the pic on the right has barred markings - quite large along the flanks, the one on the left doesn't. I'll post up some similar of a grass snake. As its aged (I know it is the same one fortunately) the unique marker has changed slightly. It is a very difficult skill to master eh!

But, great when old ones turn up after years away.

Rob

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote herpetologic2 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov 2009 at 11:02am
It just goes to show that you have to photograph the snake
in the exactly the same way each time. which I expect will
be hard to do.

I would say that both sets are a match - but there are
slight differences in the older animal

J

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Vicar View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vicar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Nov 2009 at 1:06am
Folks, some help please....

I've written a tool which allows me to upload ID photos of a Smooth snakes, and allows me to compare with the library images, so I can determine whether it is a previously known animal. This way I can measure life span, range, activity etc.

Normally ID is straight forward, but this one has me pondering. What do people think? same animal? The markings do change slightly between sloughs, more to do with contrast as the skin ages.

Thoughts...?



Ugh...and another pair. I think It's just getting late and I'm tired. I don't think these two are the same snake, just probably closely related. I.e a new specimen.





Edited by Vicar
Steve Langham - Chairman    
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AGILIS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Aug 2009 at 4:26pm
hi Steve nice pic was it a Hankley one keith
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote herpvet Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 31 Jul 2009 at 12:38pm
Originally posted by armata armata wrote:

What size is this snake, looks like an old male. I have had old males and females with various lumps and bumps.
Could this be an infection due to a scrap with another smooth snake;? you know how ant-social they are - fight at a drop of a hat (or eat each other.)
Did the swelling appear hard or soft. If you have the facility could take a blood sample (caudal puncture) sh*t forgot you need HO licence in the Uk for that, anyway I am assuming you still have the snake.

Difficult to say unless I saw it first hand. I would say male on male punch up was the best guess; but that is what it is - a guess. If I have got the sex wrong, same could apply via over amorous male.

Also - did you look inside the mouth? the lump could be a secondary infection.


Hi,

Sorry to chime in so late. Just to add to Tony's comments (I agree about the possible causes listed), don't forget the option of taking it to a vet, who would be better able to assess it thoroughly. Getting into investigation/surgery would need to be considered very carefully as to likely cost/benefits for the animal's welfare, but that should be decided in the individual case.

Hope this helps,

Bruce.
Bruce Maclean, HerpVet (veterinary) Services, Oxford.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Suzi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Jul 2009 at 10:08pm
Vicar I think your inbox is full as I've PM'd you and it won't send.
Suz
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